The 1st ATK CnC: Generals ZH Summer Tournament!

[Isphera]

OK, now the reasoning behind my questioning will start becoming clear.

I am now organising and taking entries for a 1v1 ZH tournament league. After reading the rules below, please state which are the best three days and time periods for you to be designated as a 'tournament day'.

The aforementioned rules can be found HERE (http://snipurl.com/xrnek)

The start date for the tournament is: WEDNESDAY 30th JUNE

Entry List (Those in BOLD need to declare their army for the tournament)

Oricalcos - USA Air Force
Darkeagle - USA Air Force
Toasty-Sloth - USA Laser
ez64 - USA Laser
Col. Mitch - China Nuke
Darkpidgeon - China Nuke
Target - China Nuke
Phantom - China Tank
Vicious Horizon - GLA Stealth
CILLIT BANG - GLA Toxin
Marshy - Undecided

[Vicious Horizon]

Vicious Horizon - GLA Stealth General. (Because I'm worth it)

[Calneon]

I'll enter, I don't know which armies the game has yet. How long do I have to learn the game before the tourney starts?

[Isphera]

It'll be at least a week but probably more. We gotta wait for the very infrequent visitors (Mitch, Fred, Chris etc) to come by and enter. Just don't fall in love with USA Superweapon general and it's Alpha Aurora bombers, because it's banned.

[Colonel Mitch]

Definatley entereing this one :P

I choose Nuke general i think, tho i might change to laser before it starts.

also @ VH - are you really worth it??

EDIT:

Btw what are the other rules?

SW? Rush?

I assume from what youve said SW are allowed but no mention of rushing

[Calneon]

If no rush is a rule, I will declare you all noobs...

[Isphera]

I haven't given that thought yet. I've only barred Superweapon Genral at the moment. Chances are I'll ban SW's in general, but haven't decided on the rush rule yet. Maybe along the similar line of the cash rule, I could say the default is 'no SW, 10 min no rush', but then say that if the two players agree to something different, then that will be considered the legal setting for that match. Like I say, no firm choice yet, I'll wait and see what the rest of the community thinks.

The dilema I have for the rush rule is that it is normally roughly timed anyway, and both players are not exactly impartial in deciding when they have tourney points on the line. If I have no rush rule, those in the fringe group will get raped, but with a rush rule, everyone will complain because someone jumped the gun or made it last too long, and thus it becomes unfair and uncompetitive, and nigh on impossible to enforce effectively. SW's is easier, as it's a simple yes/no and if no, simple proof of SW building (unless it's for upgrades) will DQ the person.

[Vicious Horizon]

Rush allowed, I need it if I'm going stealth gengen.

And I'd rather there wasn't ShockWank, not much of a fan of it tbh

[Colonel Mitch]

And I'd rather there wasn't ShockWank, not much of a fan of it tbh

Nobody proposed it should be shockwave vh.... lol

[Toasty-Sloth]

Yeah ill join :) dont mind the dates tbh

ill be the laser general :P

[Isphera]

Cheers Toasty. List is now updated to here. Probably a mute point, but can everyone make sure their ZH is updated to v1.04, because it can get really annoying when games don't work for something so blatently simple.

[Colonel Mitch]

Also please make sure your pc / laptiop isnt going to go into standby or aythign mid game..... its very gay when people dont notice their on battery power and then it turns off =/

[Target]

I will play, not decided what general yet though poss GLA Demo but not sure

[ez64]

Demo bike spam....

[Vicious Horizon]

I know, I'm just saying, I'd rather it wasn't shockwave.

[Isphera]

You gonna enter Giles?

[Target]

Demo bike spam....
Whats this? Demo bike???? I was thinking lol palace spam tbh :D

[Darkpidgeon]

yeah i will play. undecided about what general
either china nuke, or good old GLA demolition

[Target]

Giles @ supply drop zone spam :D but I thinks giles is waiting to see if you ban rush Oric :P
I think allowing rush may make it more interesting, seems the people who have played the game a lot before all tend to play no rush so it might give us a challenge to think up some good rush/counters???? But then again some people will get lol rolled in like 5mins so may take most of the "FUN" out of the game

[Marshy]

Im in but i need to learn to play

[ez64]

Need noob rules applied before I play otherwise the skill gap is too far.

[Vicious Horizon]

Marshy - do you have it?
If so - Just shout if you want me to show you the rules in a newbie-friendly environment.

[Toasty-Sloth]

Im only the us laser so that everytime i use ma super weapon i can go

IMA FIRIN MA LAZAR BLAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARKGH

[Isphera]

Chances are that SW in general will be banned, except for China where they are needed for upgrades, but must be sold when done. Still no decision on a 'no rush' rule yet, but expect rulings on both in the next few days.

Updated list to here. Looking to start the tournament sometime next week (maybe Monday or Teusday for evening play), so begin to start selecting your armies. Thusly, I have made the decision to go with US Air Force General.

[Vicious Horizon]

Right then Oric. Try and bomb me when you can't see me =D

- I think that rush should be decided upon at the start of a round.

[Isphera]

That's what I was thinking, but we must set a default in case the two players can't agree. Whether to give the 'home' player the full choice or have a full agreement or no rush rule - it weighs up between the benefit for the lower-skilled vs. the practicality, enforcability and usefulness of such as rule. SW's at this juncture are 99% likely of getting disallowed for the tourney. Just as an aside, the current ban list only contains SW General and GLA Demo General Demobikes.

[Vicious Horizon]

Default should be no-rush.

[Isphera]

OK - the following decisions have been made and will be added to the rulebook in due course.

1) Superweapons are BANNED. The only exception to this is for upgrades to units, and it must be sold straight afterwards. Anyone who does not comply with this rule the first or second time will be DQ'ed for the match. Anyone who subsequently breaks the rule a third time will be subject to review as to whether they should be removed from the tournament.

2) I have decided that the 'rush rule' will take the following form. By default, the rule will take the form of '10 minute no rush'. This means that there may be no attacks on the main base of a player within the first 10 minutes of gameplay. Attacks on central resources and other bases created (such as barracks on your oil derrick) are still allowed. As with the cash rule, if both players agree to a difference to this default, then that decision will take precedent over the default, but if one player disagrees with the changes, then the 10 minute rule will remain.

Also, in order for this to be fairly done, where possible, a third member of the community (most likely Piers or myself) will watch the match and ensure the full no rush timer is followed. They will give warnings at 5 minutes left, 1 minute left, 30 seconds left, 10 seconds left and no-rush expired. You may, of course, play without a watcher (matches with insta-rush allowed will not require one), but in the case of a disputed result or complaint about the rush rule not being observed, you risk being asked to do a re-match or both being credited with a loss for the match.

EDIT - Full ruleset can be downloaded HERE (http://snipurl.com/xrnek)

[Target]

lol you bothered to put up a full rule set to download Oric, how many rules have you made? :D

[Calneon]

Is Zero Hour unbalanced or something? What's the point of no rush?

[Target]

Its not totally unbalanced but some generals do have lol units that are totally op, but there nothing really that one side has better units for rush apart from maybe china inf or toxin gen. But no rush only stops you raping the others base you can still rush all the resources on the map, it just depends what maps get picked but I think it needs limiting to no bigger than a 2v2 map otherwise it could take forever :D

[Isphera]

Good point - I'll gather ideas, and probs limit it to either 2-player or 4-player maps. Decision soon.

EDIT for Phant - The point behind no-rush is to balance the skill level a little bit, because there is such a massive skill gap between the two tiers of players I've identified. As a new player yourself, when you play a couple games with us with insta-rush allowed, you'll appreciate it. As in the ruleset, there is the option to agree to a removal of the rule if both agree to it if that's what you want.

[Isphera]

OK - The following have been decided.

1) The 'tournament nights' will be on Wednesday - this does not mean your pidgeonholed into playing games then, as you can play anytime you want, but I would like many of those in the tournament to play at least a few of their matches then.

2) It would thusly follow that the tournament will start on WEDNESDAY 30TH JUNE. This means that all army declarations and entries to the tournament must be in by then. All sign-ups recieved after the end of Tuesday will be rejected and all of those who haven't selected an army will have until start of play (1900) or they will be removed.

3) Matches must be played on 1v1 maps (i.e 2-player maps.)

I'll be sorting a new thread with league and match details later today.

[Colonel Mitch]

@ Phantom - some people prefer having no rush (myself included) as it gives both of you a fair chance to build an economy and a decent size base.

Generally speaking there isn't much imbalance its just id rather (in most cases) get my best upgrades and a stealth detection network setup before the fight begins.

Also generally speaking (depending on map) the oil derricks are placed in an area where you have to fight for them, and this gives both of you the ability to put all of your early economy into the fight to take them and hold them.

@ Oric what time on wednesdays?

[Isphera]

Today is the day that the tournament shall begin. The following need to select their army by 1900 tonight! Anyone who doesn't will be removed from the tourney. Those already having declared their army may change until 1900 tonight also, at which time entries will be locked.

Phantom - Undecided
Target - Undecided (GLA Demo)
Marshy - Undecided
ez64 - Undecided on basis of rule selection

Remember, you can play your matches anytime from 1900 tonight until they are all completed, you are not pidgeonholed into the tournament night. That said, I would love for everyone in the tournament to get on to play two sets of matches every Wednesday!

[ez64]

laser USA for moi please.

[Vicious Horizon]

I can't decide between GLA Stealth or Laser......

[Colonel Mitch]

Stealth is a bit win tbh

[Target]

Nuke gen

[Isphera]

Due to my radio show tonight, the time limit for entries and declarations to be in has been moved back to 2030 GMT.

[Vicious Horizon]

I'm gonna go Stealth Gen - Purely for the lolfail that occurs through its use.

I'll happily go against anyone today.

[Calneon]

Well I beat VH :D

[Colonel Mitch]

Well I beat VH :D

So so hard

[Isphera]

Well I beat VH :D

In both matches or just the one?

[Calneon]

In both matches or just the one?
I don't know if we were playing the official game, who am I mean't to be playing?

[Isphera]

Read the rules :(. Everyone plays everyone else twice in a league format. Read the ruleset for full explanation.

I'll post a results thread later today.

[Vicious Horizon]

I think me and Phantom were playing a friendly; but as match winner it's up to him whether he wants to count it or not =)

[Colonel Mitch]

Didnt realise this effectivley started yet.

Id advise saving replays of all matches in case of dispute.

otherwise let the games begin

[ez64]

Ya I think for the win to be recorded the replay has to be sent to the tourney admin.

[Isphera]

Everyone should save replays, but I'll only ask for them if there is a result dispute. No point checking them if both players agree to the result.

[Colonel Mitch]

Just read your rules oric - you dont have anythign for if a DC happens?

whats the plan if someone looses connection / pc crashes etc. bare in mind that if the connection goes down and cant be reestablished this is both (and neitehr) players fault.

[ez64]

Ya even if it looks like another player has 70% won there is still a large chance in generals that the other player could win,.

[Calneon]

Usually the one that disconnects forfeits the match, unless both players agree to replay it.

[Colonel Mitch]

Usually the one that disconnects forfeits the match, unless both players agree to replay it.

Thats not how it works in generals phantom.

Theres no way to tell who disconected from who in a 1v1. (obvs unless its like their pc crashed), but if summit happens like hanachi jews up all it will say is both players ahve d/cd from each other

[Calneon]

Thats not how it works in generals phantom.

Theres no way to tell who disconected from who in a 1v1. (obvs unless its like their pc crashed), but if summit happens like hanachi jews up all it will say is both players ahve d/cd from each other
Yeah, but we're friends so if your PC crashes or you disconnect, I assume you would tell the other player. Obviously if it's a Hamachi problem then i'd guess you replay it.

[Isphera]

Just play the damn matches. If a problem arises, then we sort it out then. I'm getting a bit tired of every single doomsday scenario coming up. If someone DC's, then it can be for a multitude of reasons, and at different stages of the game, which, unless I watch every game personally, will not be enforceable, no matter how wide-encompassing the rule.

[Vicious Horizon]

If someone DC's then you remake your base and units in a second match, with a cease fire until both teams are up to previous strength, then the battle recommences.

That's my idea.

[Calneon]

If someone DC's then you remake your base and units in a second match, with a cease fire until both teams are up to previous strength, then the battle recommences.

That's my idea.
Hahaha yeah right. Would be better just to replay the match.

[Colonel Mitch]

Vicious thats simply ridiculous in generals.....

Brought up D/C coz its something that can happen due to reasons beyond our control. but if something happens like a dc while destroying the enemy base and they have nothing left to defend with its pretty lame if its rematch after that.