Your thoughts - 3d upgrade

[Colonel Mitch]

Lets start this with 1 thing

Im NOT going nvidia 3d vision.

Their technology is technically flawed and is going to be killed by the major companies (like hd-dvd was by blu ray).

After several hours of reading up and searching...


This places me in an awkward position of finding a screen capable of passive 3d with circular polarisation (to allow head tilting without the 3d "bleeding" between viewpoints).

I have found that a company (iz3d) produces a screen capable of this but i dont believe its currently supplied in Europe and their software is known to be glitchy.

Secondly their monitor is 22" not full hd bad contrast and looks Fugly.

but then i found the zalman have jsut started a new line of 3d monitors.

I am looking at getting the 24" one here : http://www.quietpc.com/gb-en-gbp/products/gaming/trimon

As you can see the spec is all good and its a nice design.

The technology used is similar to that in a cinema using polarised glasses, but it does not require the computer to render at 120FPS, or even a multiple of 60.

In theory (if youve seen a 3d movie youll know what im talking about) it should fix the cinema problem where the image is kinda jumpy, as that is just down to cinema using a lower frame rate, and with the monitor operating at 60 hz this shudnt be a problem.

That montor comes with 3d glasses 2 btw (2 pairs i believe, 1 for if you already wear glasses desgined to hold and cover them without discomfort).

A little background on non nvidia 3d vision 3d gaming.

Ati have had stereoscopy enabled now since 10.3 of catalyst if my research is correct, and have left it to game developers / 3rd party devs to create 3d drivers to create the 3d effect.

There are 2 main companies that do this, iz3d and DDD with their Tri-something software that does the same job.

It works with most games including WoW, CSS, MW2 and generals.

Looking at this technology rather than getting a low quality 120Hz panel should result in less eye strain and improved overall performace compared to 3d vision in demanding games where 60 Hz x2 cant be maintained.

another benefit of passive 3d is the glasses are cheap and do not need charging up and do not require an infra red transmitter (imagine going to i40 and having 2 otehr people with the ir transmitters in range - it would make the system worthless - a big oversight on nivdias behalf).

Just wanted your input as to what you think or if you have any otehr reccomendations or think ive looked over something.

If your about to post to say "i dont believe in this 3d nonsense" or something to that effect, please dont bother.

[VoX]

Did you ever try the Zalman 3D at i37? QuietPC had it on their stand and tbh it was meh at best, although I'm not sure which drivers they were using, and they were using the original Zalman 3D screens, so things may have significantly improved. (From a quick google search found out that the old screens used a version of nVidias stereoscopic driver, so that is most likely what's at fault)

This article by Tom's Hardware may be of interest, especially this page where they talk about the different 3D drivers that can be used. Each benchmark also gives the results using both sets of drivers. Hopefully that can make the driver choice a bit clearer.



I know you stated against it, but Nikoliii has the nVidia 3D vision so it might be worth asking him for his thoughts, not necessarily on the technology but on 3D gaming in general. I know he doesn't use it all the time as it can give him headaches, but not sure if thats due to the shutter technology or 3D gaming in general. (Doubt it's lack of framerates, theres a GTX480 powering it.)




My reading of the Zalman panels is not exactly in depth, but I know they use row-interleaved 3D, so technically doesn't that mean that instead of getting the full "1080p" you're simply getting 1/2 that resolution per eye? Not sure if that could lead to a lack of clarity or not.

[Vicious Horizon]

Hm; I think it's still too early to go and spend shi-tonnes of money on equipment for 3D, personally I'd wait until it became a little more established, the fault ironed out and there are some reviews that you can trust that endorse it.

[Target]

For once VH actually makes a semi-sensible point, I don' think they have it as good as it could be and probably by next year it will be and probably a lot cheaper

[D_K_Head]

And to be fair, it's not that good in the first place. Back at i37, all it really did with L4D was make the zombies look like sprites, not quite fitting into the game. I can understand how depth perception might help in some games (especially in the modern ones, where enemies don't really stand out all that much), but I'm not sure it's worth dropping a crapload of cash on something that's yet to be perfected. I think 3D's not going to be particularally good for another few years, so prehaps you should wait until the tech evolves, or the price comes down?

[Colonel Mitch]

@ VH and chris whilst this is true, this IS the new technology rising. In theory it should be the new wave starting from now.

@ DK - if you read any of the post you would realise as i said this is a different technology to the nvidia active shutter glasses. Also i should make a point that i tried the nvidia glasses at iLite and they were alot better than at i37, tho required silly frame rates to look smooth and in theory should be bad for long periods of use due to the physical flickering.

@ Vox - i noticed about the interleaving and thats the only thing im really unsure about, tho with a pixel size of significantly less than 1mm^2 in theory this shouldnt be noticable unless you get to within like 10cm of the screen.
The Zalman screen at i37 IIRC was just another 120Hz using active glasses, and it was early days of that technology too. The circular polarisation used but this interleaving technology is based on the same way a digital 3d cinema works.

Effectivley at the moment im looking for something to enhance my gaming experience. Ive started spending alot of time on WoW (due to lack of stuff to do mainly), and after playing a good half an hour of WoW on the nvidia 3d vision at iLite i must say the premise is significantly exciting, but I really dont want to get a cheap-o panel and a flawed and dying technology. During times when alot was going on (40 vs 40 battlegrounds for instance) when the frame rates dropped it became noticably "flickery" and I can see it being irritating for a 6 hour session :P, and considering with WoWs bad optimization (on full settings I only usually get around 45 fps dropping to 7-12 in raids when there are hundreds of effects on the screen) using my 4870 x2 with both cores maxed out I really dont think active is something I want to look into.

[Calneon]

@ VH and chris whilst this is true, this IS the new technology rising. In theory it should be the new wave starting from now.

It's a gimmick, nothing more.

[ez64]

It's a gimmick, nothing more.

This, also polarisation 3d techniques have been around for a very long time and without two projectors minimum its just a gimmick atm.

[Colonel Mitch]

It's a gimmick, nothing more.

Your opinion.

In my opinion its something new and fun.

@ ez i no its nothing new but in affordable screen technology it is something new.

[Isphera]

I haven't read the whole thread, but to be honest, you know my opinion of this already Piers.

To EZ and Phant - I tried the 3D they had at i-Lite, and it was much more than a gimmick. I was in the gimmick camp to start with, but within 30 seconds of playing WoW, I was convinced. A little bit of CoDMW2 later, and I was utterly sold on the idea.

Back on the main topic, I would love something like this, so I can see why you would want it.

But I must advise on the side of caution when buying this for two reasons that combine into one. Firstly, I'm sure the expense of something like this will be quite great, so I recommend seriously weighing up the Cost-Benefit of something like this. Secondly, this is still a somewhat primitive technology. It's quite possible that within a year or so, someone may put out a more effective version of this technology that would be cheaper and better. So I would research that and possibly wait a bit until you know that your getting true bang for your buck.

But if you do go for it, I look forward to seeing it in action.

[ez64]

I haven't read the whole thread, but to be honest, you know my opinion of this already Piers.

To EZ and Phant - I tried the 3D they had at i-Lite, and it was much more than a gimmick. I was in the gimmick camp to start with, but within 30 seconds of playing WoW, I was convinced. A little bit of CoDMW2 later, and I was utterly sold on the idea.

Back on the main topic, I would love something like this, so I can see why you would want it.

But I must advise on the side of caution when buying this for two reasons that combine into one. Firstly, I'm sure the expense of something like this will be quite great, so I recommend seriously weighing up the Cost-Benefit of something like this. Secondly, this is still a somewhat primitive technology. It's quite possible that within a year or so, someone may put out a more effective version of this technology that would be cheaper and better. So I would research that and possibly wait a bit until you know that your getting true bang for your buck.

But if you do go for it, I look forward to seeing it in action.

It's literally nothing like the cinema 3d experience and in my eyes the cinema is just a gimmicky form of 2D pretending to be 3D.

[nikoli]

i have the whole nv 3d kit going on veiwsonic 120hz screen glasses receiver etc
and although the glasses cost a fair ammount the effect is actually amazing. (you get headaches for the first few times) but burnout or dirt 2 or bc2 they kind of drag you into their world. its alot but i like it alot

[Colonel Mitch]

POLSKI!

Ive tried the nvidia stuff and was also impressed, however in the future the technology will become obsolete and incompatible, also the "flickering" effect that gives head/eyeaches coems from nividias active glasses.

But ty for your input nik

[Target]

Waste of money imo get your quadfire out :P

[nikoli]

mitch will there always be a giant polski thing for me in your replies? (A)